Shartak The Official Shartak Forum
Click here to play NOW!
January 19, 2018, 09:01:26 PM *
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
 
   Home   Help Search Login Register  
Pages: [1] 2 3 4   Go Down
  Print  
Author Topic: Yet another suggestion of... SCOUT/EXPLORER SKILLS!!  (Read 12595 times)
0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.
Muad'Dib
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 690


Muad "Maud" Dib


View Profile WWW
« on: March 25, 2013, 03:39:28 PM »

Yo. So, I've been thinking, and here it goes.

Short outline of your suggestion:
One new skill for the Scout, and another for the Explorer, both children of Trailblazing, and going more or less on the same direction (faster traveling through jungle).

More detailed information on your suggestion:
Outsider Explorer skill: Foresting
*Further reduces the cost of cutting through jungle from 0.5 ap to 0.3 ap (*).
*Adds a chance to get deadwood from chopping down jungle (from D10 to D6, to keep it balanced?)(is this possible at all? I recall it has been suggested before)
*Doesn't need a sharpening stone to sharpen machetes, but still spends ap to do so (**)
*Machetes take half the space in the Explorer's inventory (so, two machetes would use 1 inventory slot) (**)

Native Scout skill: Sprinting
*Running on terrains which would normally take 0.5 ap (D0-D6 jungle, caves, I think beach tiles too?, and so on) takes 0.4 ap (*)
*The above is even reduced by a further 0.1 ap if the Scout's inventory usage is at 30 things or less (regardless of backpack?) for a total running cost of 0.3 ap per tile. (*) (**)
*This skill does not stack with Trailblazing, so D7-D9 jungle still costs 0.5 ap to move through.

I thought that it would be fine to give a little bit of distinction to the two classes; we have the warrior/soldier and scientists/shaman which are quite different from their counterparts. Can't say much about Villagers and Settlers, though.

My justification is that the Native scout should be able to easily flow through the landscape without altering it much or at all, since he belongs to the island and is more acquainted with their surroundings. You know, native. On the other hand, the outsider explorer has arrived with tools to modify the jungle for him and his comrades to settle down and expand civilization, or something. So, the Scout would be more suited for doing solo missions and swiftly survey enemy camps, while the Explorer does better working in groups, quickly opening up roads for the other outsiders to use.

Possible problems: Especially for the Scout, it would use almost all the IP hits in just one character. I haven't done the maths, but it's something like 150-200 possible hits if all you do is run. Unless you donate, of course. Or make no alts.

Also, some parts could be imbalanced. Or not. And maybe hard to code?

Similar suggestions:

There's my last suggestion of scout and explorer skills, one of which was kind of like one of these. The other one was too complicated and not even I am convinced it was a good idea at all.

Swarm's take on swamp faster traveling/searching, and also track-obscuring.

Daves' suggestion of several things that could be implemented or make up for a new skill for these classes.

Johnny Hobo's thread about how underpowered these classes are.

Etherdrifter's take on Hiding and Archaeology.

And probably more, shuffled between and into other threads where they do not belong because I can't just shut up Grin

.........
(*)Not sure if my values are balanced, perhaps some testing should be done Undecided
(**)I don't know if these are easy or hard to implement. I don't really know anything about coding or w/e, so it's up to Simon to clear it up, I guess.
Logged

YEAH SCOUTS!

Trawling. Scouts and explorers alone can find extra stuff in the water.
I think trawling is appropriate because the classes feel like being in a pool of sadness.


Dani
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 1684


drama queen in recovery.


View Profile
« Reply #1 on: October 27, 2013, 11:03:31 PM »

Quote
Outsider Explorer skill: Foresting
*Further reduces the cost of cutting through jungle from 0.5 ap to 0.3 ap (*).
*Adds a chance to get deadwood from chopping down jungle (from D10 to D6, to keep it balanced?)(is this possible at all? I recall it has been suggested before)
*Doesn't need a sharpening stone to sharpen machetes, but still spends ap to do so (**)
*Machetes take half the space in the Explorer's inventory (so, two machetes would use 1 inventory slot) (**)
I have a hard time picturing anyone apart from dedicated road-builders would find this one useful.

Quote
Native Scout skill: Sprinting
*Running on terrains which would normally take 0.5 ap (D0-D6 jungle, caves, I think beach tiles too?, and so on) takes 0.4 ap (*)
*The above is even reduced by a further 0.1 ap if the Scout's inventory usage is at 30 things or less (regardless of backpack?) for a total running cost of 0.3 ap per tile. (*) (**)
*This skill does not stack with Trailblazing, so D7-D9 jungle still costs 0.5 ap to move through.
That one's not bad, the backpack part might complicate things.

I also have two skills to consider for both scouts/explorers.

1) Scouts/Explorers can put out fires easier, either with less water or with an AP cost, child skill of the fire skill. Fires are a significant problem in a lot of the jungle, and now that fires burn they become even more of an obstacle instead of a refuge. This would make either class high in demand as a support unit for villages.

2) Scouts/Explorers can set a spot on the map for revival, separate from camp/roamer revive but with the same cost as a roamer revive. Only one spot can be set at a time.

This one is obviously more controversial because of the effect it would have on pking. I don't know what the answer might be. The first idea I had for this was that a scout/explorer could mark a village other than its own for revive with the caveat that if he harmed chars from that village he wouldn't be able to use that village as a revive point. But I have no idea how the game would be able to recognize that. This one seems easier but obviously there might be more problems. Perhaps it can't be used consecutively on the same spot? All revive points would have to be marked on the char map beforehand. I got the idea from the Safehouse skill in UD.
Logged

Quote
Shroombaker says “Who was it that was looking for Dani al..la-ka-zam?
FirstAmongstDaves
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 5987


Does other things too.


View Profile
« Reply #2 on: October 28, 2013, 01:30:20 AM »

The first suggestion seems innocuous enough. The second is a huge advantage.

Here are my scout suggestions:

a. they can see the health of animals ("Animal Triage");
b. they automatically have the Faith skill unlocked;
c. they can cross deep water for 1AP ("Catching Currents").

Muad'Dib - I do like the all-terrain sprinting concept.
« Last Edit: October 28, 2013, 01:32:14 AM by FirstAmongstDaves » Logged

Read my stuff!!! -  www.worldcomicbookreview.com
Jalal
Sr. Member
****
Posts: 375



View Profile
« Reply #3 on: October 28, 2013, 05:11:52 PM »

Catching currents - like random currents in water would be good..
Logged

Well, he should have armed himself if he's going to decorate his saloon with my friend.
Zeek
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 585



View Profile
« Reply #4 on: October 28, 2013, 08:22:14 PM »

how about a bushcraft skill of some sort? maybe increased search rates in jungle squares, with higher rates for each level of density. say, +5% per level.
Logged
Dani
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 1684


drama queen in recovery.


View Profile
« Reply #5 on: October 28, 2013, 08:33:52 PM »

What would you be searching for? Apart from driftwood (which is a waste of AP unless it's on a boatyard square) there's nothing really valuable in jungle.

Now if it were SWAMPS, that would be useful, especially now. But I doubt scouts had 'resource-gathering' in mind when they picked the class; we already have a class for farmers.
Logged

Quote
Shroombaker says “Who was it that was looking for Dani al..la-ka-zam?
Zeek
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 585



View Profile
« Reply #6 on: October 28, 2013, 10:17:32 PM »

you can find all sorts of things in jungle squares, but i think the most valuable thing would be healing herbs. basically the idea is that scouts/explorers can be the 'living off the land' class, who can go long periods without having to go back to town & resupply.
Logged
Dani
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 1684


drama queen in recovery.


View Profile
« Reply #7 on: October 28, 2013, 10:28:27 PM »

Already have that class. Scientists can heal themselves, supposedly with branches and twigs and stuff, but really just for an ap cost, and only half-way.
Logged

Quote
Shroombaker says “Who was it that was looking for Dani al..la-ka-zam?
Muad'Dib
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 690


Muad "Maud" Dib


View Profile WWW
« Reply #8 on: October 28, 2013, 10:29:28 PM »

Jungle yields junk items most of the time, or at least junk items for a scout (fruits, bottles, blunt stuff, and rifles. lots of rifles). Herbs are not so common, and charms are terribly rare. Besides, yeah, there are settlers and villagers who already get a skill that improves search rates. As a tangent, at the moment the scientist is the class with the most survival chances in the wild without supplies. They can do anything!

I think another cool thing for scouts would be a skill that hides the [1 native] thing from the map. Maybe there has to be a minimum of jungle density on the square, and maybe you'd have to use ap to "hide", and if someone steps on the same square as you they would get the "Here is a native/outsider, they are Player##" in the description as usual. I dunno if it should help against animals? I don't really think so.

Animal triage is nice, but it would be so situational I wouldn't really put it as a separate skill (unless it was a fixed exp skill, like pirate-speech). The animals you find in the jungle are almost always at full health. I can see it helping python and squid hunters a lot, though, and if it lets you see the hp of shamans (and traders) then there's something special...

EDIT: you ninjas.
Logged

YEAH SCOUTS!

Trawling. Scouts and explorers alone can find extra stuff in the water.
I think trawling is appropriate because the classes feel like being in a pool of sadness.


FirstAmongstDaves
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 5987


Does other things too.


View Profile
« Reply #9 on: October 29, 2013, 12:59:54 AM »

OK: what about an item in the jungle which only scouts/explorers can find and use? A staff, which lets scouts and explorers travel at an accelerated pace?
Logged

Read my stuff!!! -  www.worldcomicbookreview.com
andrewbuff
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 569



View Profile
« Reply #10 on: October 29, 2013, 01:34:58 AM »

or a large jungle leaf, which can hide an explorer/scouts tracks. after a few uses, the leaf's stem breaks and you gotta get another.
Logged

woodrow guthrie: a derby folk singer. out to map the entire island and bag some exotic game.
fluffhead: a york fellow who is helping operate the derby training facility. are you dtf?
Dani
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 1684


drama queen in recovery.


View Profile
« Reply #11 on: October 29, 2013, 03:17:49 AM »

OK: what about an item in the jungle which only scouts/explorers can find and use? A staff, which lets scouts and explorers travel at an accelerated pace?

All right, but instead of a staff, let's call it a magic mcguffin.
Logged

Quote
Shroombaker says “Who was it that was looking for Dani al..la-ka-zam?
error
Sr. Member
****
Posts: 405


Shartak's least valuable player.


View Profile WWW
« Reply #12 on: October 29, 2013, 03:57:34 AM »

Scouts need hang gliders. Right? Explorers can have hot air balloons. It's perfect.
Logged

Little Bunny Foo Foo The excitable adolescent.
Last Laugh The erratic antihero.
Alcohol Poisoning The easy-going auctioneer.
FirstAmongstDaves
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 5987


Does other things too.


View Profile
« Reply #13 on: January 23, 2014, 11:24:13 AM »

Trawling. Scouts and explorers alone can find extra stuff in the water.

Everyone else finds broken knives.
Logged

Read my stuff!!! -  www.worldcomicbookreview.com
Muad'Dib
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 690


Muad "Maud" Dib


View Profile WWW
« Reply #14 on: January 23, 2014, 03:26:08 PM »

That must the worst band-aid ever suggested to fix the scout class, but then again it might be me having a snarkier day than usual.

I don't think the point is in giving these classes a new useless skill, or a skill that really doesn't do anything (like those blasted parrots), or a skill everyone else already has but earlier. I'd be pretty pissed off if one of those things were picked up as means of "balancing", but tbh I don't play my scout anymore.

Honestly I don't think scouts/explorers will ever be re-balanced. I guess it's fine, is like playing the game hard-mode. Maybe they are balanced but it just doesn't feel like it.

No, they are not. So much for a skill that only helps making roads. Maybe they could be scrapped and split into some of the other existing classes. Like villagers or something. They'd still be a pretty boring class that now chops jungle faster.
Logged

YEAH SCOUTS!

Trawling. Scouts and explorers alone can find extra stuff in the water.
I think trawling is appropriate because the classes feel like being in a pool of sadness.


Pages: [1] 2 3 4   Go Up
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.21 | SMF © 2006-2008, Simple Machines Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!