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Author Topic: Haunting Needs a Nerf  (Read 6212 times)
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Killian
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« on: February 19, 2013, 01:47:43 AM »

Basically what Neil said about his conga line of creepers. An army of ghosts can tag along a character to the ends of the earth island with absolutely no risk. Put into the context of ghost(s) with nothing better to do, ie, throwaway alts, they now have a distasteful amount of tenacity at their disposal. This is an inverse pyramid of mechanics and requires balancing. More than that, it's pretty lame.

In other games, homing abilities are set to a limited number of charges, or set to a cooldown timer, to inhibit their potency. Limiting the charges makes more sense for Shartak. Other options for tweaking the skill are welcome for discussion.
« Last Edit: February 19, 2013, 01:51:45 AM by Killian » Logged
Cold Seether
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« Reply #1 on: February 19, 2013, 04:22:10 AM »

It seems to me that the folks being haunted are the ones doing things to deserve to be haunted. Think of yourself as Tiger Woods and they as your gallery.
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andrewbuff
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« Reply #2 on: February 19, 2013, 05:09:16 AM »

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZxxPLDZnqwA
they spelled "haunters" wrong though.
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woodrow guthrie: a derby folk singer. out to map the entire island and bag some exotic game.
fluffhead: a york fellow who is helping operate the derby training facility. are you dtf?
Tuttle Freely
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« Reply #3 on: April 25, 2013, 01:28:04 AM »

It seems to me that the folks being haunted are the ones doing things to deserve to be haunted. Think of yourself as Tiger Woods and they as your gallery.

I would somewhat agree; folks being haunted should be tracked by a live player character for whom the outcome is largely unknown. One can think of themselves as Tiger Woods only if the other trackers are pro-golfers playing in the same tournament, subject to the same risks and rewards.

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A mechanic that allows a player to inevitably reach the location of their killer is really too informative. Now we know you like to hide here rather than somewhere else altogether. That type of information should require a bit of guesswork and effort.

*One thing that might be done as a fix is to make all tiles appear black once a player chooses to haunt her/his killer. This way there is no free scouting. Thematic reasoning is that the thirst for revenge is blinding and singular in focus. Then the ghost can wail for damage.
« Last Edit: April 25, 2013, 01:30:02 AM by Tuttle Freely » Logged
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« Reply #4 on: April 25, 2013, 02:22:23 AM »

My Last Laugh character has been haunted and has been doing a bit of haunting. And I enjoyed both. I like talking to ghosts that are haunting, it give Last Laugh a captive audience and he'd love that. Cool

Personally I'm not too annoyed with the haunting function.
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jaqs
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« Reply #5 on: April 25, 2013, 03:28:03 AM »

If you don't want to be haunted by someone then don't kill them...?

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Cold Seether
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« Reply #6 on: April 25, 2013, 06:53:19 AM »

If you don't want to be haunted by someone then don't kill them...?



That's one of those pieces of advice along the lines of "Never get involved in a land war in Asia" or "The Cobra wouldn't have bit you if you'd refrained from French kissing it." Yet another piece of pointless advice that is impossible to accept.
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andrewbuff
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« Reply #7 on: April 25, 2013, 07:22:08 AM »

i heard its also not wise to tug on supermans cape, spit into the wind, pull the mask off that ol' lone ranger or for that matter, mess around with jim.
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woodrow guthrie: a derby folk singer. out to map the entire island and bag some exotic game.
fluffhead: a york fellow who is helping operate the derby training facility. are you dtf?
Killian
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« Reply #8 on: April 25, 2013, 03:04:44 PM »

Oh, I actually posted this? All right then.

Cold Seether, true, true, all true, but my infix was that throwaway alts could drag down another player's game just to grief them. What if there was a lone sheriff fending off pkers from their town? A rather unsavory sort of griefer could simply track him with an ghost alt they'd only need only log in briefly to do so. As far as I could tell it wouldn't trigger a curse. That sort of zoning ability is quite a bit of power.

Here is another side of the point. Almost missed this, giving this newbie recognition for clarity of mind, thanks Tuttle! (I'm not biased at all!)

A mechanic that allows a player to inevitably reach the location of their killer is really too informative. Now we know you like to hide here rather than somewhere else altogether. That type of information should require a bit of guesswork and effort.
« Last Edit: April 25, 2013, 03:07:26 PM by Killian » Logged
jaqs
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« Reply #9 on: April 25, 2013, 03:26:39 PM »

If you don't want to be haunted by someone then don't kill them...?


That's one of those pieces of advice along the lines of "Never get involved in a land war in Asia" or "The Cobra wouldn't have bit you if you'd refrained from French kissing it." Yet another piece of pointless advice that is impossible to accept.

All very good advice really... Sorry though. It was the best I could come up with at 3am.

It still seems to me that in killing another player there should be some sort of risk involved...repercussions? But it is not guaranteed that a player will have the skill for haunting so it is just a potential risk. There are a couple of other limitations as well. Maybe there should be a chance that the ghost would fail or be led the wrong way? If so I think it should be a small chance...?
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Muad'Dib
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« Reply #10 on: April 25, 2013, 04:03:22 PM »

IMO currently the repercussions for spirits compared to those who are living are kinda out of balance. You see, when you kill and are alive there's always the risk that you'll die afterwards, and that risk was there even before the skill. Spirit players have actually nothing to lose, and this skill takes away even that. Even exorcism isn't that much of a big deal. Well, usually,. it's still pretty annoying when you are in the SH and someone summons you elsewhere and then throws you away but you can always float back... I still can't help it being surprised about the fact that this skill was implemented among all the other suggestions there have been recently. Opinions are like nipples, anyway, so it doesn't matter...

I kinda lost the point I was going to halfway through my post, but anyway I'm kinda against this skill the way it currently is... however it's not like it makes too much of a difference from before Undecided
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jaqs
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« Reply #11 on: April 25, 2013, 05:24:40 PM »

IMO currently the repercussions for spirits compared to those who are living are kinda out of balance. You see, when you kill and are alive there's always the risk that you'll die afterwards, and that risk was there even before the skill. Spirit players have actually nothing to lose, and this skill takes away even that. Even exorcism isn't that much of a big deal. Well, usually,. it's still pretty annoying when you are in the SH and someone summons you elsewhere and then throws you away but you can always float back... I still can't help it being surprised about the fact that this skill was implemented among all the other suggestions there have been recently. Opinions are like nipples, anyway, so it doesn't matter...

I kinda lost the point I was going to halfway through my post, but anyway I'm kinda against this skill the way it currently is... however it's not like it makes too much of a difference from before Undecided

I think I see your point. (Not about the nipples though.. that is just well.. eh?)
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Cold Seether
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« Reply #12 on: April 25, 2013, 05:40:44 PM »

What if there was a lone sheriff fending off pkers from their town? A rather unsavory sort of griefer could simply track him with an ghost alt they'd only need only log in briefly to do so. As far as I could tell it wouldn't trigger a curse. That sort of zoning ability is quite a bit of power.

I knew a guy who had that sort of gig once. Lonely job, from what I was told, and it ended up killing the guy.

I don't know. Maybe that haunting would bring the bad guys closer. The problem is knocking off the vermin was that they always had holes to hide in, far from the chilly grasp of justice. If something was to bring them into the open, they can be tracked. If they can be tracked, they can be killed. Or so I heard from the dead guy.
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Killian
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« Reply #13 on: April 25, 2013, 06:29:59 PM »

You see, when you kill and are alive there's always the risk that you'll die afterwards, and that risk was there even before the skill. Spirit players have actually nothing to lose, and this skill takes away even that.

  • Spirit players lack the richer experience that living players do. The variety of tropes that come from the normal playstyle just stomps over spirit gameplay. Unfortunately there are players who are fine with being a ghost with a mini god complex.
  • My problem with Haunting is that it allows a high reward factor for a one dimensional playstyle. For a game that is stagnant in growth there shouldn't be opportunities to turtle unwaveringly. As said, even with exorcism there's little reason for a spirit to play cautiously. They just have to get from point A to point B and Wail. Even NPCs are more interesting than some of the ghosts out there.
  • I saw your point about the nipples (but still, lol, what?), which is why I used the ever scientitfic bullet points.
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Killian
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« Reply #14 on: April 25, 2013, 06:38:49 PM »

I don't know. Maybe that haunting would bring the bad guys closer. The problem is knocking off the vermin was that they always had holes to hide in, far from the chilly grasp of justice. If something was to bring them into the open, they can be tracked. If they can be tracked, they can be killed. Or so I heard from the dead guy.

Baiting is good, but from the other thread we know a PKer can cover their tracks completely with coordination from other characters (likely zergs). For a successful bait, town defenders need to be a step ahead, but I would be discouraged knowing the game mechanics offer a multiplicative edge for the opposition. I don't like the advantages that comes with haunting or a carpet of twenty feet.
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