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Author Topic: Discussion of Referendum for West Shartak Ministry of Justice Election mk I  (Read 2914 times)
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Euphenics
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« on: February 22, 2009, 08:43:01 PM »

OOC: As a result of unanticipated changes to my schedule in real life the election will be delayed. In the mean time however I will be able to discuss a referendum to be added to the election.

The subject of this referendum proposal is the management of illegal assault and murder in Durham. You may propose additional subjects for referendum, add additional options for existing ones, or comment on them.

The following are options that I propose for the referendum on illegal assault and murder law:

Option One:
If an individual with no criminal record in Durham kills someone in Durham and the victim presses charges, the defendant can either pay a fine of 20 gold coins for a Durham national or 40 gold coins for a foreign national (because they must exert more effort to return to Durham) OR they can dispute the charges and be tried by three magistrates or a jury for acquittal, no fine, reduced fine, or full fine.

If an individual with a criminal record which has been completely served kills someone in Durham and the victim presses charges, the defendant can either pay a fine of 30 gold coins for a Durham national or 60 gold coins for a foreign national OR they can dispute the charges and be tried by three magistrates or a jury for acquittal, reduced fine, or full fine.

If an individual with a criminal record which has not been completely served kills someone in Durham and the victim presses charges, the defendant has 72 hours to either pay a fine of 30 gold coins for each unserved Durham national and 60 gold coins for each unserved foreign national OR dispute the charges and be tried by three magistrates or a jury for acquittal, reduced fine, or full fine for each unserved offence (fines may be substituted with alternative punishments at the request of the defendant). If defendant does not, the victims are issued one termination warrant on the defendant for each unserved offence which they may use themselves or give to a licenced police agency for completion.

Option Two:
If an individual with no criminal record in Durham assaults (attacks the victim without healing them to at least 9 HP below their original health [a minimum of 41 of 50 if they were 50 of 50 before] in a reasonable amount of time) or kills someone in Durham and the victim presses charges, the defendant can either pay a fine of 1 gold coin per 5 HP damaged below original health (rounded up), 30 gold coins for killing a Durham national, or 50 gold coins for killing a foreign national OR they can dispute the charges and be tried by three magistrates or a jury for acquittal, no fine, reduced fine, full fine, or increased fine.

If an individual with a criminal record which has been completely served assaults or kills someone in Durham and the victim presses charges, the defendant can either pay a fine of 2 gold coins per 5 HP damaged below original health (rounded up), 40 gold coins for a Durham national, or 60 gold coins for a foreign national OR they can dispute the charges and be tried by three magistrates or a jury for acquittal, reduced fine, full fine, or increased fine.

If an individual with a criminal record which has not been completely served assaults or kills someone in Durham and the victim presses charges, the defendant has 72 hours to either pay a fine of 2 gold coins per 5 HP damaged below original health (rounded up), 40 gold coins for each unserved Durham national, and 60 gold coins for each unserved foreign national OR dispute the charges and be tried by three magistrates or a jury for acquittal, reduced fine, full fine, or increased fine for each unserved offence (fines may be substituted with alternative punishments at the request of the defendant). If defendant does not, the victims are issued one termination warrant on the defendant for each unserved offence which they may use themselves or give to a licenced police agency for completion.
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AlexanderRM
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« Reply #1 on: February 23, 2009, 12:10:30 AM »

...this seems rather overcomplicated.

Perhaps you could have a certain status- say, "legal", or whatever- for not having committed any crimes (which includes, in this context, killing people) or for having willingly paid the appropriate punishment, possibly along with something like "semi-legal" if you've been killed an appropriate number of times for any crimes you didn't willingly pay for and you appeal for this status... and there are various things you can get for these statuses, most notably that if you have either of them it's illegal to kill you, and also whatever other government benefits that might be added, and perhaps the ability to vote and hold office as well...

And anyway, you have a certain fine you can willingly pay for killing (or assaulting?) someone illegally so as to retain "legal" status, and if you refuse to pay it (and are found guilty/don't bother to go to trial) you become a fugitive until you've been killed once for every count of murder (or assault?) that you haven't willingly paid for.

That was getting rather complicated on it's own, actually...

A major point of that is that, if you manage to commit crimes more rapidly than you can be forcibly punished for them, you can have a general arrest warrant issued (anyone can kill you), and you can also be punished in whatever other ways you can think of besides killing.

Oh, also- don't forget to do something to prevent people from hiding in Durham and killing or sending hired killers outside of it.
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Euphenics
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« Reply #2 on: February 23, 2009, 01:17:34 AM »

It is less complicated than most real world statutes.

A grade system is conceiveable, though it would have no effect on elections. The statuses pristine, legal, probation, unsentenced, and fugitive could be incorporated. Pristine would be the virgin state which can only be possessed by someone whom hasn't offended and receives reduced fines. Legal would receive normal fines. Probation would apply to recent frequent offenders defined by a set period during which fines are increased. Unsentenced would apply to those which still owe fines and can become fugitives for offending before paying them and not paying them all within 72 hours. Fugitives would first be reprised on a kill by kill basis until they pay their fines or are pardoned and could be escalated to kill on sight if severe enough.

Unless foreign governments want Durham to expedite, which we won't, hiring someone in Durham to kill someone else outside Durham or residents killing outside of Durham is none of our business. However, hiring someone inside or outside of Durham to kill someone else inside Durham is illegal for the client.

I propose a fine for killing Kadmor or Dick. Perhaps 100 gold coins for the first offence and 200 or more for each additional offence.
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AlexanderRM
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« Reply #3 on: February 23, 2009, 01:24:38 AM »

I wasn't necessarily saying that you should punish people for killing outside of Durham or hiring killers to kill outside of Durham, but if you've been killed 10 times by hired mercenaries the person hiring them shouldn't be able to press charges against you for killing them... that's just absurd.
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